INTERVIEW WITH CHUMBAWAMBA FROM TheCelebrityCafe.com ARCHIVES
DM) So when did you first start getting involved in music?
DB) I was in a punk band in the late '70's and in various bands in the '80's. When punk came along, it was like a breath of fresh air. It was a thing in the music industry that was basically saying, "F*** you", which totally shook up the industry. It was a demonstration that you didn't have to be particularly talented to be in a band. It was more about attitude than musical ability.
DM) I've heard the argument before that since punk, nothing has seemed to shake the music industry around as much. What's your take on that?
DB) The music industry is constantly shifting and working in different ways. The only other time that I've had that feeling was when reggae/dance music exploded in Britain in the late '80's, which was a similar sort of thing in the fact that it was a lot of people doing things themselves. So in that sense, I think something else will work itself out as the "shake up" music too. I think it's a cyclical thing anyway.
DM) In your musical career between the '80's and with your recent hit, "Tubthumping", you've said that there was a bit of a lull in your success. What kept you going through that lull?
DB) Well, we stayed together as a band because we totally believed in what we were doing. Also, we all had different ideas, so we were changing all the time as well. It was always interesting to us, what we were doing. It was something that we just developed over the years. It was an idea that started off with a few people and had sort of grown, and with that we were trying new thoughts and new ideas. Some have been successful and some have not.
DM) The reason I was asking was because right before I came here, I read an article which had a unique theory about a band's longevity. The author went on the premise that unless a band has a hit within the first few years, they're done for. On the contrary, you guys stayed together for so long and then had the big hit; but you still stayed together.
DB) It's funny, because for all those years when we didn't have the hit, we were playing these rather large venues throughout Europe. So we always felt as though we existed in an underground, alternative scene. We were quite a big fish in that scene. It was only a few years ago that we came into what a lot of people regard as mainstream. So in all of the years before, we felt as though we were rather successful anyway. We weren't selling tons, but we were selling around 50,000 copies of the albums, which was enough to keep us touring. To us, that was fun, because we were doing what we enjoyed doing.
DM) When did you first feel "successful"?
DB) Successful to us is probably different than successful is to a lot of other bands. Successful to some bands is probably how big your bank account is, or how high up on the charts your records are. For us, we've always gauged it by, "How long have we been able to do what we enjoy doing and still survive?" So, now it's been twenty years. But when we had the hit "Tubthumping'", we didn't think, "Wow, we're a success now", but we thought that we'd just entered a new phase in Chumbawamba's history. Now we're in a position where we can appear in all of these shows and do more of what we want.
DM) Just because of one song, your entire lives have changed then.
DB) Yes, just because of one song. (Pauses, thinking)
DM) It's an amazing concept that after twenty years of shows and twenty years of songs, with this one song you've become valid in the music industry's eyes.
DB) It makes you realize how a load of bollix the music industry is, in that you can wait that long for something exciting to happen; and when it happens, everything goes from black to white. That's kind of strange in itself--how suddenly you're thrust into the limelight and then after the hit, you have something interesting to say and they NOW look at you as an interesting person, whereas you've had all of those years before when nobody was interested in talking to you because you didn't have a hit single.
DM) I find the transition in this band's life more interesting than the hit single itself. The idea that you've lasted 20 years as an alternative indie band and then, suddenly, with a single you're a top-40 band that the public has perceived as just beginning.
DB) It was amazing for us, because to me it just went crazy. Doing all of this stuff we've never done before. Being on this TV show or that one, or being interviewed by someone else. I think it's because so much of society is based on the cult of the celebrity, and as soon as you've had that kind of success, people associate stuff about you anyway. And it was great for us, because we now had a platform... for years we've been doing and saying stuff that if we did it now, it would be really controversial. Or we were putting out records that now would be considered much more controversial. It's weird that we are now guaranteed a certain minimum amount of press coverage.
DM) Does it ever frustrate you that while there might have been songs you've done over the past 20 years, you're now haunted by this one hit?
DB) Well, not really, because before that we were a "no hit wonder", but now at least we're a "one hit wonder".
DM) Have the relationships within the band changed with the stages of the band's growth? When it started as a side-gig in the 1980's, or a European band in the 1990's, and finally the recent hit to, as you put it, a "one hit wonder"?
DB) It's changed, I think a lot of the time we've been apt to put more and more trust in each other, and everybody's more and more dedicated to the band. When somebody isn't as "into it" as the rest of us, it becomes apparent quite quickly. I think that over the years we've been to hell and back with each other and we're still together now. We've developed a very high tolerance level. We know each other so well we've learned to co-exist well together.
DM) Do you think you'd still remain friends if the band didn't work out?
DB) Oh, yes, absolutely.
DM) Are the friendships based more on the relationships or are they based on the music?
DB) Definitely on the relationships. We probably spend more time with the people in the band in meetings and arranging things than we do playing music.
DM) Doesn't it ever get frustrating that you're spending more time arranging things than doing music?
DB) Not really. I'm not a musician, I'm just a guy who gets on stage and shouts and perhaps jumps around. I know that's my role in the band.
DM) You mentioned before about turning into the "one hit" stage. Do you have a song that you feel has the potential to be hit number two?
DB) We never wrote this album to have singles on it, really. That was never our concern. When we did the album "Tubthumping", we were writing 12 songs to be an album, each of which could be a good single. Now with this album, it's very much that we wanted to do something totally different, and in doing that, what fell by the wayside was the effort of trying to write a hit single. I love this album and I think it has some great tracks on it, but that wasn't the intent of our time in the studio. We wanted to do something that we enjoyed and that was different from our last album.
DM) Keeping in mind that playing what you enjoy can potentially be different from a hit single, and the idea that what you enjoyed at one point was punk, how do you classify your hit, "Tubthumping"--which isn't exactly a punk theme song?
DB) For us, punk is an attitude, it's an idea... how we first interpreted punk was believing in yourself and doing something for yourself, and believing in what you were doing and not being held in by certain constraints in what you should and shouldn't do. It's about changing all the time.
DM) If believing in yourself and doing what you want to do is a "punk attitude", what was the most "un-punk" thing you've ever done?
DB) The most compromising thing is that we played "Tubthumping" at an EMI record executive conference. I think that was a particular low point. We were talked into it for various reasons.
DM) "Tubthumping" has a message...do you think the executives got the message?
DB) Well, I think they listened to it, but I think they might have been incapable of hearing the message, and they might have focused on units (sold), units, units instead.
DM) It's interesting about the message. The message is actually about workers' rights in England, but I wonder how many people who bought the record even heard it.
DB) It's weird that when the song came out, everybody asked what the song was about... that in itself used to make us wonder whether it was all worth while, but not only were we a band, but we did it because we thought we had something interesting to say.
DM) How many people who heard the song actually got the message and how many who heard it just thought the beat was kind of nice?
DB) With something as big as that, I think the majority of people just liked the music. I think it's simply a song that just caught people's imagination. I think a majority of people wouldn't have realized what the band was trying to say. The message isn't as overtly political as some other ones we've done. People would say, "That song really helped me, and that one really inspired me". I've heard it on all different levels and it became a bit of a phenomenon...and it won't happen to us ever again.
DM) You're that assured that it wouldn't happen again?
DB) Not on that scale, it was ridiculous.