In an effort to back his claim that streaming has a long way to go before overtaking the broadcast networks, NBC executive Alan Wurtzel revealed ratings for Netflix and Amazon shows.

Wurtzel, NBC’s president of research and development, told reporters that Wednesday at a Television Critics Association Press Tour lunch session that the broadcasting model is not “broken or dying,” reports Deadline. He cited data from the media monitoring firm Symphony Advanced Media.

Based on their data of just 15,000 people, Symphony estimates that Marvel’s Jessica Jones drew 4.8 million viewers in the 18-59 demographic between September and December 2015, Wurtzel revealed. (It’s worth noting, of course, that Jessica Jones didn’t go live on Netflix until late November.)

Wurtzel also said that Aziz Ansari’s Master of None had 3.9 million viewers over that period, and Narcos had 3.2 million. Orange is the New Black had 644,000 two months after the third season went live. Amazon’s The Man in the High Castle, which Amazon said was its most-watched show ever, had 2.1 million viewers.

“Compare these programs to shows like The Big Bang Theory, Empire or Blind Spot, and they pale in comparison. It’s not that people aren’t watching, but they (streaming) aren’t replacing broadcast,” Wurtzel said.

Even though the Symphony numbers came from such a small sample, Wurtzel said he was still confident in them, noting they’re in “beta,” reports The Hollywood Reporter. “I think they're valid. They give you a sense of what the size is — whether it's 4.4 million or 4.2 million, I don't think [it] matters,” he said.

This should all be taken with a grain of salt because it only includes Symphony’s data on the 18-49 demographic. Statistics could always be molded to make a point. Why didn’t Wurtzel and Symphony get estimates for total viewers instead of just the demo?